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Ugradnja tempomata u Punto/Stila/Multiplu/Nouva Bravo/Alfa 147/Alfa 156

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Pozdrav,

Hoću da ugradim tempomat (cruise control) u auto koji to nikada nije imao kao dodatnu opremu (Multipla 1.9 JTD 2002.) Doduše, ne znam, mehanika i elektronika su dosta slični Fiatu Bravo, pa ako je Bravo to imao, možda je i Multipla. Često vozim auto-putem i to bi mi stvarno bilo olakšanje.

Nađoh na forumima da ljudi ugrađuju neke jednostavne uređaje, koji naravno nemaju sve osobine pravog tempomata (da drži zadatu brzinu bez obzira na opterećenje, uspon...) pa me zanima vaše mišljenje. Da li je to neko već ugradio, ili se petljao sa time? Meni se čini da je to baš korisna stvarčica za ljude koje vole penzionersku vožnju (poput mene).

Evo primera:

http://cgi.ebay.nl/Eagle-Handgas-Tempomat_...emZ190258436557

Ima i moćnijih sistema:

http://www.conrad-anderson.co.uk/cruisecon...ontrol-kits.htm

Pre, koliko se sećam, mnoga vozila su imala onaj "ručni gas"... naravno da je to daleko od tempomata, ali je bilo bar neko olakšanje.

Pq1CZnlS.jpg

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...evo par tekstova koji ti mogu pomoći... :cool:

...'' određena vozila su isporučena bez tempomata mada su mogla bit naručena sa njim...na takve modele postoji mogučnost ugradnje...''

...'' neki auti imaju komplet instalaciju, neki pola, neki ništa...a na neke se ni ne može stavit tempomat...''

...''auto mora imat električnu kontrolu leptira u usinoj grani...''

A, evo kako se to uradi na Stilu...Možda i to pomogne... :cool:

What You Will Need

1.

A Cruise Control Stick! These cannot be ordered separately from FIAT for the Stilo, so you??™ll have to source one from a breakers yard for example. I got mine as part of a whole column stalk set off eBay so keep a lookout there too. You can get one for an Alfa Romeo 147; it shares the same fixings and connector, but you will have to adapt the steering shroud for it to fit properly. Part Number for this stalk is 735365522.

gx1q3gYA.jpg

Tools! A Size 3 Allen key and a pozidrive screwdriver may be all you??™ll need, but some may require a 10mm socket setup too.

(Hopefully) A new lower steering shroud, one to fit round the cruise control stalk.

Only go ahead with this if you??™re confident; I don??™t want to hear any stories of Stilos not starting after this. Also, you'll read in a few pages about Stilo's that aren't wired up; it has come to my attention that other modifications to the Stilo are required for this to work, and as I do not know the extent, all information here is provided as A BASIS WITH NO GUARANTEE that it'll work!

2.

One little problem . . .

Retrofitting cruise control to the Stilo incurs one problem; the LED on the instrument cluster will NEVER illuminate. From what I understand, the cruise control stalk is wired straight to the Engine Node (hence it is not placed on the CAN line at the clock spring). When switched ON, the engine node will place a ???Cruise Control is ON??? message on the CAN network. What would normally happen is the Body Computer would read this, then place a ???Switch Cruise LED ON??? signal on the CAN, for the instrument cluster to pick up. However, as none of the Stilos without it haven??™t had the option programmed into the Body Computer, it will not know what the ???Cruise Control ON??? signal is, hence never submitting the ???Switch Cruise LED ON??? signal. This you??™re going to have to accept and live with! The Examiner can switch the light on manually by mimicking the ???Switch Cruise LED ON??? signal though.

3.

Categorisation of your Stilo

Firstly, these instructions are going to be categorised as follows:

- FULLY PREDISPOSED Stilos

- SEMI PREDISPOSED Stilos

- NON-PREDISPOSED Stilos.

To find out which category your Stilo falls in, you must remove the lower steering shroud, which is held on by 3 Allen screws (Size 3 from what I remember). Then, be on the lookout for this connector (it's hanging to the left ):

Pq1DRptr.jpg

On mine , it was taped to another loom. If that connector is there, go to page 4. It was believed that Stilos with ESP are pre-wired, however this is not the whole story, as my mum's 1.6 without ESP was wired too. One could speculate that if the vehicle is pre-03 it's wired, but I do not know for definite. If it is not, venture into the engine department. Remove the battery cover (3 M6 bolts, 2 on later vehicles) and look for a Brown connector, as shown below:

aV1D0rfS.jpg

If that is there, go to 4. If not, go to 5.

4.

Installation of the Stalk

With the cowling still removed, offer up the stalk to where it should go, and you??™ll see that the front of the mount will be passing over a screw on the column stalk. Remove that screw (see first picture). Now, offer it up again, and it??™ll click into the back. Replace the screw at the front. Having had another set of column stalks, I also fitted the screw behind (see second picture); it??™s not essential but I wanted it done properly.

All this is self-evident when you look at the car. You might need to remove the top shroud to get access; it??™s held on by two Allen screws at the top near the steering wheel.

Picture to Come Soon . . .

Once done, connect the stalk to the connector, clip the connector assembly onto the end of the stalk, and replace everything (with the new shroud). Take the car for a spin and notice that you??™ll have Cruise (albeit without the light on the dash!).

5.

Wiring from the Brown Connector

With this, you need to take the wiring from this connector , through the bulkhead, then up to the steering column. The pin-to-pin configuration is as follows:

D4B (Brown Connector) ------> H7 (Cruise Control Stalk)

Pin A02 ------> Pin 1 (Green) RESUME

Pin A03 ------> Pin 6 (Orange/White) SPEED -VE

Pin A04 ------> Pin 5 (Orange/Black) SPEED +VE

Pin A05 ------> Pin 4 (Violet) ON/OFF

D4B Connector

gx1q46lA.jpg

H7 Connector

Pq1DS2nJ.jpg

Remember: The pin out diagrams for D4B are for the non-existent connector that would go into D4A (D4A is the one on your car). Although its damned obvious: the row with the wires is obviously Row A, and there is one pin not-connected (A01), then moving along the next 4 are connected, so A06 to A08 are also not connected.

All you need to do then is connect Pin 2 of the Cruise Control Stalk (Blue) to a +12V feed. There is a dedicated feed from the body computer (Pin 17 of of the brown connector), but you could get a generic 12V feed from the battery or somewhere inside the car with an in-line fuse (the fuse rating on the body computer is 7.5A). Pin 3 on H7 is not connected. If you get stuck, see the wiring diagram on the last page.

Now feed the 4-core wire (2 sets of speaker wire would be ideal, just remember which wire is which!) into the bulkhead. One way suggested is as follows:

1. Remove the drivers side A-pillar and locate the bulkhead grommet.

2. Make a hole just large enough for the wire and feed through.

3. Feed the wire (from the engine bay) under the scuttle plate and into the main engine compartment.

4. Wire up to D4A.

5. Inside the car, allow enough length to go past the body computer and up into the steering area.

6. Replace everything!

I??™d also wrap it to other looms using black insulating tape for an original look .

It is also a requirement that the brake pedal and clutch pedal switches need to be modified to allow this to work . . . watch this space! (PM me if you're doing it and the information isn't up yet).

6.

Only read this if you??™re sure you can??™t find the brown connector in the battery box!

What you??™ll need to do for this is to take the feed for the 4 cruise feeds (see last section) directly from the engine node.

Once located, you will see the following connector:

gx1q4nOA.jpg

The following wires must be connected then fed to the cruise control stalk (see the previous or next page for stalk wiring):

M10-A (Engine Node) ------> H7 (Cruise Control Stalk)

1.2 16V

Pin 58 ------> Pin 4

Pin 41 ------> Pin 1

Pin 08 ------> Pin 5

Pin 09 ------> Pin 6

1.6 16V

Pin 33 ------> Pin 4

Pin 17 ------> Pin 1

Pin 41 ------> Pin 5

Pin 21 ------> Pin 6

1.8 16V

Pin 57 ------> Pin 4

Pin 23 ------> Pin 1

Pin 53 ------> Pin 5

Pin 31 ------> Pin 6

2.4 20V

Pin 10 ------> Pin 4

Pin 42 ------> Pin 1

Pin 58 ------> Pin 5

Pin 43 ------> Pin 6

1.9 JTD

Pin 53 ------> Pin 4

Pin 55 ------> Pin 1

Pin 56 ------> Pin 5

Pin 57 ------> Pin 6

Then, proceed as with the previous page to get the wire into the car, then hook up the +12V feed etc etc. . .

7.

Just incase you want to use another method for switching (someone on the Italian Stilo forum used a Sony joystick!), here is the wiring information:

Pin 1 = Green = Resume

Pin 2 = Blue = +12V feed

Pin 3 = Not Connected

Pin 4 = Violet = ON/OFF Switch

Pin 5 = Orange/Black = Speed +ve

Pin 6 = Orange/White = Speed -ve

Iskustvo čoveka koji je to uradio, ali on ima MultiJet, a ne JTD...

...'' Konacno je jucer stigla rucica tempomata za Alfu 147 i ugradjena je danas u Stilo 1.9 MultiJet. Sto reci nego da sve sljaka kako treba.

Moj Stilo je dosao totalno zicano neopremljen za ovaj zahvat, pa je tu doslo do izrazaja moje poznavanje elektronike.

Za sve one koji ce to eventualno ugraditi imajte moje iskrene preporuke za ovu rucicu jer mehanicki potpuno pase na konzolu na koju se ugradjuje. Jedino sto treba preraditi je jedan mali vijak, koji se odvije s poluge za zmigavac, zamjeniti 5-6 milimetara duzim a donju plastiku volana treba samo malo pazljivo izrezati i to je to.

Spomenuo sam da je auto bio totalno zicano nepripremljen sto znaci da sam morao povlaciti zice izravno u ECU. ZA MultiJet motore koriste se slijedeci pinovi na ECU-u za Cruise Control: 77 ON, 38 Restore,

78 - i 56 +.

Morao sam najprije odspojiti akumulator da bi odspojio konektor sa ECU-a (veliki konektor blizi kabini). Uslijedio je kratkotrajni sok. Nema niti kontakata u konektoru na pinovima koji se ne koriste. Rastavio sam konektor i malo ga proucio. Malo sam usporedjivao kontakte i ustvrdio da su pinovi vrlo slicni kao pinovi na audio kabelu koji se u PC-u koristi za spajanje CD-ROM >>> zvucna kartica. Izvadio sam 4 komada s kabela, zalemio zice u njih i ugurao ih u veliki konektor. Buduci da nisu 100% isti i da vole kliznuti van kod spajanja osigurao sam ih tako da sam nakon guranja pinova u konektor zagurao one male plasticne iglice koje sluze kao cepovi na konektoru gdje nema zica i to je savrseno dovoljno.

Usljedio je jos jedan problem. Gdje provuci kabel?

Malo sam gledao kuda provuci ali bi trebalo rastavljati neke komponente u motornom prostoru pa sam odustao od toga jer sam bio krajnje nestrpljiv da vidim hoce li proraditi. Malo sam proucio kuda bi provukao kabel i krenuo. Kabel sam vukao iz ECU-a u plasticnu kutiju za accu i osigurace, zatim izmedju veznog lima i blatobrana na vozacevoj strani pa prema vratima, i usao u kabinu kroz mali gumeni cep pored velikog konektra za vrata. Dalje kroz pretinac za osigurace pa na konzolu volana. Nestalni vod +12 sam skinuo s kontakt brave tako da sam ugurao malo jace pin s rucice u izvode koji idu s kontakt brave i spoj je odlican i bez lemljenja ili kidanja pa spajanja.

Usljedio je kretkotrajni test i odusevljenje ucinjenim poslom. Sve radi onako kako je i predvidjeno. Najvise sam se bojao da ne zeznem sa spajanjem na ECU ali me je ohrabrilo to sto kad sam mjerio rucicu onda svaki izvod prema van iz rucice ima otpornik po 330 Ohm-a sto je dobro ako se slucajno spoji na krivi pin da ne dodje izravno +12 na pin nego preko otpornika koji bi sprijecio pregaranje ECU-a.

Puno srece kod buducih ugraditelja Cruise Control-a i slobodno me kontaktirajte za savjet. Rucicu koju sam ja koristio je rucica za Alfu 147 i pase skoro pa savrseno osim sto treba donju plastiku obloge stupa volana samo malo pazljivo izrezati da sve sjedne na svoje mjesto. Rucica izgleda super i neovisni promatrac ne vidi nikakvu razliku dali je tvornicka ili naknadna ugradnja.

FIAT-ov kod za nabavku rucice je "735365522" ''

Svi tekstovi preuzeti sa CroFiat

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Guest 573

Oni mehanicki sto se prodaju su totalna glupost vise nerviraju nego sto koriste.

To ti je isto ko rucni gas.

E sad razmisljam o elektronici koja bi drzala zadati broj obrtaja.

Znaci uzimala bi signal broja obrtaja i upravljala step motorom koji je prikacen na leptir gasa.

Jedno dugme za aktivaciju i zica sa pedale kocnice za reset.

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Nesho, hvala ti za post... ali to uputstvo sa CroFiat foruma važi samo kad auto ima predinstalaciju za tempomat. Onda je lako... pitanje se svodi samo da li ima žica do volana ili moraš da ih sam vučeš od ECU-a. Da imam Stilo odmah bih ugradio. Ali ovaj moj ECU (gledao sam Multipla eLearn dokumentaciju) nema uopšte pinove za tempomat. Proverio sam... nikad ni jedan model nije izašao iz fabrike sa ugrađenim "cruise controlom".

Znači mora naknadna ugradnja od nule. Dobro, možda ne baš od nule jer JTD motor ima "fly by wire" gas pa tu već imaš prekidače, takođe i na kvačilu.

Evo šta sam nađoh, to je uglavnom što se nudi a da je kvalitetnije:

Waeco Magic Speed MS 800

(Comfort cruise control for vehicles with electronic accelerator)

http://www.waeco.com/en/298.php

Spal RG 8

http://www.sempal.co.uk/acatalog/SPAL_ELEC...SE_CONTROL.html

Siemens VDO Tempostat

http://www.vdo.com/press/pictures/special-...at-20020401.htm

Nije baš jeftinoća (za VDO Tempostat: 350 EUR + 38 EUR za ručicu) ali koliko neki daju na audio sistem i točkove ovo je džabaleska. ;)

Inače, videh sad na sajtu, na primer za novi Fiat Bravo doplata za tempomat je 280 EUR, što je stvarno sramota ako se radi samo o ručici (i malo žica)... a verovatno je tako, jer je Cruise control već integrisan u ECU.

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Ne znam koliko košta, ali evo šta kažu oni koji su se petljali time...

CroFiat: "Za Stilo se ne može naručiti samo ručica tempomata nego cijeli sklop zajedno s ručicama za svijetlo i brisače pa se stoga pribjeglo jeftinijoj varijanti naručivanjem ručice tempomata za Alfu 147 jer je mehanički 99% kompatibilna a električki 100% i svi mi koji smo to ugradili imamo upravo ručicu od AR147."

Ali vidim da su neki postigli rezultate i sa Sonijevim daljincem za radio koji se montira na stub volana...

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Da, za Stila nema posebno rucica, vec moraju i ostale da se kupuju... Ja sam gledao dok sam imao Stila. Odgovara od Alfe 147 i nju mozete naci posebno, samo treba proveriti da li imate prikljucak za tempomat. Skine se ona plastika ispod volana i treba da ima neki dzek. Vrlo je moguce da svi imaju

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Ja sam ugradio tempomat u mog stila po uputstvima sa fiatforuma.com. Ručicu sam nabavio sa otpada. Kod mene nije postojao priključak ispod volana pa sam morao da sprovodim žice do konektora kod akomulatora. Takođe se mora sprovesti žica od prekidača kočnice jer bez toga tempomat ne radi. Jedino mi se ne pali indikacija na tabli da je tempomat aktivan, ali i to ću rešiti kad se dočepam negde examinera.

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hvala kolegama sa cro foruma ugradio sam na stilo jtd sw tempomat ,imao je kablove tako da je bilo lako ,i tacno je da moze komanda od sony-a bitna razlika je da rucica kosta polovna 60e a sony 1e i jos bitnije u vozni iskoristite gornji taster na sony za razliku od original rucke gde mora da se uvrne obrtni prsten, tj mnogo je zgodnije za rukovanje .jos jednom hvala kolegama sa cro foruma pozdrav

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^^ Iz gornjih postova:

Ali vidim da su neki postigli rezultate i sa Sonijevim daljincem za radio koji se montira na stub volana...

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gde svi turci tu i mali nestor :welcome: ha ha

e i mene zanima ugradnja tempomata ali lybra je u pitanju...pa jel bi zavrsila posao ta rucica od alfe ili mora jos nesta da se dokupljuje (motor,sajle...)

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Ja sam narucio rucicu od Stila originalnu, a ne znam da li imam uopste pripremljenu instalaciju za to! Nadam se da ima! :)

Ako ne bude onda je rucica, tempomat na prodaju :)

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Sad sam skidao plastiku ispod volana, imam konektor sa 5 zica!

Sad me zanima jel samo ustekam tempomat u to i zavrsena stvar ili ima jos nekih poslica?

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koje ti je boje konektor?

to bi trebalo da je to. Samo ustekas i radi :]

e sad, nesto sam cituackao na fiatoforumu i kazu da preko examinera moze cak i da se namesti da se lampica pali kad ga upalis, nemam pojma da li je to zapravo moguce.

takodje, ja imam konektor ispod volana, ali nemam onaj braon konektor pored akumulatora. Verovatno zato sto nije polu pripremljen sa ugradnju nego skroz, pojma nemam.

Fali mi jos samo negde da nadjem prokletu rucicu. Kad sma pitao u AP sportu onaj decko me je belo pogledao i rekao da je nacuo da kao nesto tako moze ali da mu niko zapravo nikad nije trazio da nabavi rucicu za alfu. Jedino da zapucam po otpadima, samo i to pojma nemam gde, a ni koliko izadje (cisto da se psihicki spremim XD )

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Pošto ja nemam komplet instalaciju nego onaj braon konektor kod akumulatora jel ba mogao abarth da mi malo pojasni (pošto je on imao isti slučaj i radio je) gde se kači ta žica od prekidača kočnice na ručicu tempomata koji pin?ovo ostalo mi je jasno

hvala unapred

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Konektor ispod volana je bele boje (sa 6 "rupa") i ima 5 zica

zelena

plava

"prazno"

ljubicasta

narandzasta-crna

belo-crvena

Kod akumulatora ne znam sta ima, nisam ni gledao :)

Zanima me jedna stvar, ako imam konektor kod volana da li je potrebno uopste gledati ispod haube sta ima i treba li sta povezivati osim onoga ispod volana?

Mirko imas li konektor ispod volana uopste?

Edited by Rax011

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